Are the words in the Bible "imperfect"?

[Hobie]

People like to say that the Bible is 'inerrant', but who wrote the Bible, think about it. It was written by 'imperfect' men, yes they were inspired, but it was there finger that put it down and not God. As I point out, only the Ten Commandments can be called 'inerrant' as that was written by God with His own finger. The words in the Bible were sufficient for doctrine as the Holy Spirit can guide you into all truth, but the words were not 'perfect' if we seek that because it was in the language of man whether Latin, Greek, or Hebrew, which was not sufficient to give the full meaning of Gods words. The reason is that mans words were 'imperfect' in describing the fullness and completeness of God and His interaction with us, but it was just the means to communicate His purpose from the beginning. The Holy Spirit must bring us to understanding the perfection of inerrancy, for He speaks and shows the words of Christ.

John 16:13-14
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

 

[bobinfaith]

I have two comments regarding the Bible and it's emphasis of the language being closest to the Hebrew and Greek.

The Hebrew and Greek are categorized as the formal equivalence and original languages of God's Word. They have deeper meanings, insight and understanding. I would like to include that the Hebrew and Greek have multiple meanings.

For example, the KJV opens in Genesis 1:1, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Heaven is singular. The translator chose the singular heaven and when we study deeper the Hebrew will offer it's explanation and further meaning. However, other translators will use the plural heavens.

God's Word is inerrant and I believe the writers were perfectly assigned by God Himself. But I can't see how this becomes imperfect because His servants were human authors. The human authors were led by God, He guided them and kept His Word inerrant.

The only erroneous examples of imperfect reading of the Scriptures are the scholars, theologians and publishers who produced so many "acceptable" translations that watered down the Scriptures thus making them imperfect from the original text.

My other comment suggests the English text seem to lose credible meaning because of the original Hebrew and Greek. In a disciple's English study of the Bible enables their application of sharing the Gospel. If we added further study of the same Scriptures being closest to the Hebrew and Greek, would this make our witness to the unbeliever more effective?

God bless this topic for learning and understanding.

 

[David]

People like to say that the Bible is 'inerrant', but who wrote the Bible, think about it. It was written by 'imperfect' men, yes they were inspired, but it was there finger that put it down and not God.

I want to speak plainly and respectfully. What you are teaching here follows the same pattern used in Seventh day Adventist doctrine. You are weakening the authority of Scripture, elevating the Ten Commandments above the rest of the Word, and suggesting the Bible is “imperfect” unless another interpretive system fills in the gaps. That is not the teaching of the Bible.

Scripture says its words are pure, not flawed. “The words of the LORD are pure words, as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times” ~Psalms 12:6. Jesus said, “Thy word is truth” ~John 17:17. Truth is not imperfect. He also said, “The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35. If it cannot be broken, it is not deficient.

God used human writers, but the message is still perfect because the Holy Spirit carried them as they wrote. “Holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost” ~2 Peter 1:21. Paul said, “All Scripture is given by inspiration of God” ~2 Timothy 3:16. Theopneustos means God breathed. What God breathes out is not imperfect or lacking.

Your statement that only the Ten Commandments are inerrant contradicts the very way Jesus treated the written Word. When resisting temptation He said, “It is written” again and again in Matthew 4. He relied on the written Word as flawless authority. He did not separate one part of Scripture from another.

The Holy Spirit does guide us into truth, but He does not correct the Bible or replace it. Jesus said the Spirit would take what He has already spoken and make it known to us ~John 16:13 through 14. The Spirit illuminates Scripture. He does not fix supposed imperfections in it.

This is exactly the approach used in SDA teaching, and I want to be clear. You are not permitted to teach Seventh day Adventist doctrine on this forum. Our rules state that no unbiblical movements or extra biblical systems are allowed to be promoted here. That includes the SDA investigative judgment, the close of probation theory, and the idea that Scripture is imperfect. We follow Scripture alone. We do not add to His words or place any outside authority over the Bible ~Proverbs 30:6.

You are welcome to participate here. You are not welcome to teach SDA doctrine or any other extra biblical system. This forum stands on the authority and sufficiency of the Word of God alone.

 

[David]

My other comment suggests the English text seem to lose credible meaning because of the original Hebrew and Greek. In a disciple's English study of the Bible enables their application of sharing the Gospel. If we added further study of the same Scriptures being closest to the Hebrew and Greek, would this make our witness to the unbeliever more effective?

Studying Hebrew and Greek can help any believer understand Scripture more clearly, but the Bible never says that deeper language study makes our witness more effective. Scripture says the power is in the gospel itself ~Romans 1:16 and that faith comes by hearing the Word ~Romans 10:17. The Spirit is the One who convicts the unbeliever ~John 16:8, not our language skills. So language study can help you grow, but the effectiveness of reaching the lost comes from the Spirit working through the Word, not from how much Hebrew or Greek we know.

 

[Hobie]

I want to speak plainly and respectfully. What you are teaching here follows the same pattern used in Seventh day Adventist doctrine. You are weakening the authority of Scripture, elevating the Ten Commandments above the rest of the Word, and suggesting the Bible is “imperfect” unless another interpretive system fills in the gaps. That is not the teaching of the Bible.

Scripture says its words are pure, not flawed. “The words of the LORD are pure words, as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times” ~Psalms 12:6. Jesus said, “Thy word is truth” ~John 17:17. Truth is not imperfect. He also said, “The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35. If it cannot be broken, it is not deficient.

God used human writers, but the message is still perfect because the Holy Spirit carried them as they wrote. “Holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost” ~2 Peter 1:21. Paul said, “All Scripture is given by inspiration of God” ~2 Timothy 3:16. Theopneustos means God breathed. What God breathes out is not imperfect or lacking.

Your statement that only the Ten Commandments are inerrant contradicts the very way Jesus treated the written Word. When resisting temptation He said, “It is written” again and again in Matthew 4. He relied on the written Word as flawless authority. He did not separate one part of Scripture from another.

The Holy Spirit does guide us into truth, but He does not correct the Bible or replace it. Jesus said the Spirit would take what He has already spoken and make it known to us ~John 16:13 through 14. The Spirit illuminates Scripture. He does not fix supposed imperfections in it.

This is exactly the approach used in SDA teaching, and I want to be clear. You are not permitted to teach Seventh day Adventist doctrine on this forum. Our rules state that no unbiblical movements or extra biblical systems are allowed to be promoted here. That includes the SDA investigative judgment, the close of probation theory, and the idea that Scripture is imperfect. We follow Scripture alone. We do not add to His words or place any outside authority over the Bible ~Proverbs 30:6.

You are welcome to participate here. You are not welcome to teach SDA doctrine or any other extra biblical system. This forum stands on the authority and sufficiency of the Word of God alone.

I dont think the authority of the scripture is being questioned, my brother, but there are limits of language for mankind to say nothing of the translation of the new editions/versions coming out. Instead we must study and strengthen the faith of Gods people against the questions raised against it and be prepared to defend it.

 

[Hobie]

Studying Hebrew and Greek can help any believer understand Scripture more clearly, but the Bible never says that deeper language study makes our witness more effective. Scripture says the power is in the gospel itself ~Romans 1:16 and that faith comes by hearing the Word ~Romans 10:17. The Spirit is the One who convicts the unbeliever ~John 16:8, not our language skills. So language study can help you grow, but the effectiveness of reaching the lost comes from the Spirit working through the Word, not from how much Hebrew or Greek we know.

Amen, Gods Word has the power to sanctify and the Holy Spirit guides us into all truth.

 

[David]

I dont think the authority of the scripture is being questioned, my brother, but there are limits of language for mankind to say nothing of the translation of the new editions/versions coming out. Instead we must study and strengthen the faith of Gods people against the questions raised against it and be prepared to defend it.

You keep shifting the issue. I didn’t say language is perfect. I said Scripture is. The Bible never says its authority is weakened because of “limits of language” or modern translations. That is your claim, not God’s. Scripture says the exact opposite.

“The words of the LORD are pure words” ~Psalms 12:6.
“Thy word is truth” ~John 17:17.
“The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35.

If God calls His Word pure, true, and unbreakable, then saying it needs outside correction is not a small thing. It directly contradicts what God has already said about His own Word.

You’re also avoiding the point that your earlier comments match the standard SDA pattern. SDA doctrine claims Scripture is not fully reliable unless interpreted through an outside lens. That is not what the Bible teaches, and it’s not allowed here.

God never instructed us to be skeptical of the clarity or sufficiency of His Word. He told us to defend it because it is already perfect. “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him” ~Proverbs 30:5. The very next verse warns not to add to His words, which is exactly why this matters.

You can’t use “limits of language” to justify doctrines the Bible does not teach. Jesus didn’t do that. He resisted Satan by standing on “It is written” without suggesting the text needed correction or supplementation.

So let me be clear in love and truth. You’re welcome here. Your ideas are not welcome when they drift into SDA teaching or undermine Scripture’s sufficiency. This forum stands on the Word of God alone, and the Word doesn’t need a safety net.

If you want to strengthen the faith of God’s people, start by agreeing with what God says about His own Word.

 

[Hobie]

You keep shifting the issue. I didn’t say language is perfect. I said Scripture is. The Bible never says its authority is weakened because of “limits of language” or modern translations. That is your claim, not God’s. Scripture says the exact opposite.

“The words of the LORD are pure words” ~Psalms 12:6.
“Thy word is truth” ~John 17:17.
“The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35.

If God calls His Word pure, true, and unbreakable, then saying it needs outside correction is not a small thing. It directly contradicts what God has already said about His own Word.

You’re also avoiding the point that your earlier comments match the standard SDA pattern. SDA doctrine claims Scripture is not fully reliable unless interpreted through an outside lens. That is not what the Bible teaches, and it’s not allowed here.

God never instructed us to be skeptical of the clarity or sufficiency of His Word. He told us to defend it because it is already perfect. “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him” ~Proverbs 30:5. The very next verse warns not to add to His words, which is exactly why this matters.

You can’t use “limits of language” to justify doctrines the Bible does not teach. Jesus didn’t do that. He resisted Satan by standing on “It is written” without suggesting the text needed correction or supplementation.

So let me be clear in love and truth. You’re welcome here. Your ideas are not welcome when they drift into SDA teaching or undermine Scripture’s sufficiency. This forum stands on the Word of God alone, and the Word doesn’t need a safety net.

If you want to strengthen the faith of God’s people, start by agreeing with what God says about His own Word.

Well, thats was my point on man, (who have language that is limited). Now the Jews would not change 'one dot or tittle' as they held that the words that were given were sacred, so copied it word for word and so we have these manuscripts. But the new versions change it to whatever is the current view or idea, and we see the distortion and corruption.

 

[David]

Well, thats was my point on man, (who have language that is limited). Now the Jews would not change 'one dot or tittle' as they held that the words that were given were sacred, so copied it word for word and so we have these manuscripts. But the new versions change it to whatever is the current view or idea, and we see the distortion and corruption.

Removed for Promoting Unbelief

The post you are referring to concerning “changes to the Bible” has been removed. It was based on historical speculation and man’s theories, not the clear testimony of Scripture. We stand on what God Himself says about His Word, not on manuscripts, scholars, or debates.

“The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever.” ~Isaiah 40:8
“Your word is truth.” ~John 17:17
“Do not go beyond what is written.” ~1 Corinthians 4:6

While we will admit there are small textual variants between manuscripts, not one of them alters the gospel or changes any doctrine of the faith. God has kept His Word for His people and Scripture is fully trustworthy.

For that reason we will not promote or allow anything that would shake a person’s confidence in the Bible or bring doubt without a Scriptural basis.

If anyone has questions about why the Bible can be trusted based on what the Bible itself says, please ask.

 

[Hobie]

I have two comments regarding the Bible and it's emphasis of the language being closest to the Hebrew and Greek.

The Hebrew and Greek are categorized as the formal equivalence and original languages of God's Word. They have deeper meanings, insight and understanding. I would like to include that the Hebrew and Greek have multiple meanings.

For example, the KJV opens in Genesis 1:1, In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Heaven is singular. The translator chose the singular heaven and when we study deeper the Hebrew will offer it's explanation and further meaning. However, other translators will use the plural heavens.

God's Word is inerrant and I believe the writers were perfectly assigned by God Himself. But I can't see how this becomes imperfect because His servants were human authors. The human authors were led by God, He guided them and kept His Word inerrant.

The only erroneous examples of imperfect reading of the Scriptures are the scholars, theologians and publishers who produced so many "acceptable" translations that watered down the Scriptures thus making them imperfect from the original text.

My other comment suggests the English text seem to lose credible meaning because of the original Hebrew and Greek. In a disciple's English study of the Bible enables their application of sharing the Gospel. If we added further study of the same Scriptures being closest to the Hebrew and Greek, would this make our witness to the unbeliever more effective?

God bless this topic for learning and understanding.

We have to be on guard with these new translations, and allow the Holy Spirit to guide us on this.

 

[Hobie]

Removed for Promoting Unbelief

The post you are referring to concerning “changes to the Bible” has been removed. It was based on historical speculation and man’s theories, not the clear testimony of Scripture. We stand on what God Himself says about His Word, not on manuscripts, scholars, or debates.

“The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever.” ~Isaiah 40:8
“Your word is truth.” ~John 17:17
“Do not go beyond what is written.” ~1 Corinthians 4:6

While we will admit there are small textual variants between manuscripts, not one of them alters the gospel or changes any doctrine of the faith. God has kept His Word for His people and Scripture is fully trustworthy.

For that reason we will not promote or allow anything that would shake a person’s confidence in the Bible or bring doubt without a Scriptural basis.

If anyone has questions about why the Bible can be trusted based on what the Bible itself says, please ask.

Well, can I show you where words were put in that were not the original, and you can delete the post if deemed inappropriate. We can look at "Easter". The Greek word that the King James Version translates as “Easter” is actually the word “Pascha” (Hebrew: פסח—Pesach) which means “Passover”. It was during an annual Passover celebration that Jesus was crucified at Jerusalem. Here is the text in question:

Acts 12:4 King James Version

"4 And when he had apprehended him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to keep him; intending after Easter to bring him forth to the people."

We find it was translated incorrectly because the bible scholars preconceived ideas led them to this. If we look at the text from previous versions we find it was correctly translated...

Acts 12:4 1599 Geneva Bible

"4 [a]And when he had caught him, he put him in prison, and delivered him to four quaternions of soldiers to be kept, intending after the Passover to bring him forth to the people."

Acts 12:4 Wycliffe Bible

"4 And when he had caught Peter, he sent him into prison; and betook him to four quaternions of knights, to keep him, and would after pask bring him forth to the people [willing after pask to bring him forth to the people]."

And others..

Acts 12:4 Complete Jewish Bible

"4 so when Herod seized him, he threw him in prison, handing him over to be guarded by four squads of four soldiers each, with the intention of bringing him to public trial after Pesach."

Acts 12:4 Young's Literal Translation

"4 whom also having seized, he did put in prison, having delivered [him] to four quaternions of soldiers to guard him, intending after the passover to bring him forth to the people."

 

[bobinfaith]

Studying Hebrew and Greek can help any believer understand Scripture more clearly, but the Bible never says that deeper language study makes our witness more effective. Scripture says the power is in the gospel itself ~Romans 1:16 and that faith comes by hearing the Word ~Romans 10:17. The Spirit is the One who convicts the unbeliever ~John 16:8, not our language skills. So language study can help you grow, but the effectiveness of reaching the lost comes from the Spirit working through the Word, not from how much Hebrew or Greek we know.

Hello David;

I agree with you in studying the Hebrew and Greek can help any believer understand Scripture more clearly. I'll share more on that later.

I'm referring to the application, "the ones who get out there and share the Gospel and our witness to all peoples." There are many savvy, smart and brilliant minds that cross our paths that can ask good questions about God, debate the "what ifs" about Jesus, promote their own (false doctrines,) etc...

My personal testimony was many years ago when I was at the train station and a JW approached me. He was doing his due diligence to convert me. I wasn't prepared, equipped or prompted by the Holy Spirit to respond to his articulation of being a JW. I escalated our conversation by getting angry. At that point he knew when to back off and politely walked away. (They're trained that way.)

That was a lesson learned on my part. Years later when I crossed paths with a JW, or other sect, I was better prepared and equipped through my growing study of the Bible. We ended our conversations amicably. He or she wasn't converted but what mattered was I planted the Gospel Truth and prayed for them. I couldn't say that years ago.

Others have shared their experiences and lessons with me and have also learned. Being prompted by the Holy Spirit is a fundamental teaching in our discipleship. Still, evangelizing is not easy. It takes practice in sharing our faith.

Personally, I don't believe the deeper our study of the Hebrew, Greek makes us more effective. But I believe our deeper study of God's Word equips and prepares us in the application of our witness, prompted by the Holy Spirit, of course. That is the effectiveness that I'm referring to.

God bless everyone.

bobinfaith

 

[David]

Well, can I show you where words were put in that were not the original, and you can delete the post if deemed inappropriate.

I already gave you an answer, and the answer is still no. We are not opening a door for SDA style arguments about supposed corruption in the Bible. That entire line of discussion comes from a system that treats Scripture as if it needs to be corrected by outside ideas. The Bible never teaches that.

God says His Word is pure and preserved.
“Every word of God is pure” ~Proverbs 30:5
“The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35
“Your word is true from the beginning” ~Psalm 119:160

The issue in Acts 12:4 is a translation choice, not a change to God’s Word. The Greek text says pascha, meaning Passover, and every major translation reflects that. Nothing about the inspired Word has been altered.

What we are not doing on this forum is giving space for SDA teachings that undermine confidence in Scripture or introduce the idea that we need outside authorities to tell us what God really said. This forum stands on Sola Scriptura. The Word is enough.

If you have a genuine question about a passage, ask it. But we are not entertaining posts that promote doubt or Adventist doctrine under the surface. That line has been drawn.

 

[David]

Personally, I don't believe the deeper our study of the Hebrew, Greek makes us more effective. But I believe our deeper study of God's Word equips and prepares us in the application of our witness, prompted by the Holy Spirit, of course. That is the effectiveness that I'm referring to.

Just to clear things up, the issue here is not translation discussion. There is nothing wrong with talking about Greek words or how different English Bibles render a verse. Scripture itself shows believers examining the text carefully ~Acts 17:11.

The concern is the pattern behind the way this topic was being used. Seventh Day Adventists often begin with translation questions in order to push the idea that the Bible is not fully reliable unless filtered through their doctrine. That approach slowly erodes confidence in the Word, and Scripture warns me to guard against anything that does that.

This is not my first encounter with SDA teachings or any other kind of false doctrine. I deal with that constantly on other forums. The whole reason I started this Biblical Truth Forum was to create a place where we can focus on the truth of Scripture without having to fight off false teachings every time a discussion begins.

Scripture tells me to guard the flock and protect the truth.
“Hold fast the form of sound words” ~2 Timothy 1:13
“Guard what has been entrusted to you” ~1 Timothy 6:20
“Test all things. Hold fast what is good” ~1 Thessalonians 5:21

So the issue here is not translation discussion. The issue is that SDA arguments often start with translation points and end with undermining trust in the Bible itself. I am not allowing that here. This forum exists so believers can grow in the Word without that constant pressure.

I am committed to keeping this place centered on Scripture, and anything that tries to weaken confidence in the Word will be stopped immediately.

So I am not shutting down honest translation questions. I am shutting down an approach that tries to make people doubt the truth and preservation of Scripture. That is not going to happen on this forum.

If someone wants to study the text, great. If someone wants to plant mistrust in the Bible, that door stays closed.

 

[Hobie]

I already gave you an answer, and the answer is still no. We are not opening a door for SDA style arguments about supposed corruption in the Bible. That entire line of discussion comes from a system that treats Scripture as if it needs to be corrected by outside ideas. The Bible never teaches that.

God says His Word is pure and preserved.
“Every word of God is pure” ~Proverbs 30:5
“The Scripture cannot be broken” ~John 10:35
“Your word is true from the beginning” ~Psalm 119:160

The issue in Acts 12:4 is a translation choice, not a change to God’s Word. The Greek text says pascha, meaning Passover, and every major translation reflects that. Nothing about the inspired Word has been altered.

What we are not doing on this forum is giving space for SDA teachings that undermine confidence in Scripture or introduce the idea that we need outside authorities to tell us what God really said. This forum stands on Sola Scriptura. The Word is enough.

If you have a genuine question about a passage, ask it. But we are not entertaining posts that promote doubt or Adventist doctrine under the surface. That line has been drawn.

We have to discern though on these "translation choices", and I think we all can agree God can unveil what He has for us, if we prayerfully study His Word and allow the Holy Spirit to guide.

 

[bobinfaith]

Just to clear things up, the issue here is not translation discussion. There is nothing wrong with talking about Greek words or how different English Bibles render a verse. Scripture itself shows believers examining the text carefully ~Acts 17:11.

The concern is the pattern behind the way this topic was being used. Seventh Day Adventists often begin with translation questions in order to push the idea that the Bible is not fully reliable unless filtered through their doctrine. That approach slowly erodes confidence in the Word, and Scripture warns me to guard against anything that does that.

This is not my first encounter with SDA teachings or any other kind of false doctrine. I deal with that constantly on other forums. The whole reason I started this Biblical Truth Forum was to create a place where we can focus on the truth of Scripture without having to fight off false teachings every time a discussion begins.

Scripture tells me to guard the flock and protect the truth.
“Hold fast the form of sound words” ~2 Timothy 1:13
“Guard what has been entrusted to you” ~1 Timothy 6:20
“Test all things. Hold fast what is good” ~1 Thessalonians 5:21

So the issue here is not translation discussion. The issue is that SDA arguments often start with translation points and end with undermining trust in the Bible itself. I am not allowing that here. This forum exists so believers can grow in the Word without that constant pressure.

I am committed to keeping this place centered on Scripture, and anything that tries to weaken confidence in the Word will be stopped immediately.

So I am not shutting down honest translation questions. I am shutting down an approach that tries to make people doubt the truth and preservation of Scripture. That is not going to happen on this forum.

If someone wants to study the text, great. If someone wants to plant mistrust in the Bible, that door stays closed.

Hello David;

I made my position very clear as best I can but feel we're discussing different things here (SDA?) and our points aren't aligning. This is where I'll respectfully bow out.

Last month I read the forum rules and have no issue at Biblical Truth Forum.

God bless everyone.

bobinfaith

 

[bobinfaith]

We have to discern though on these "translation choices", and I think we all can agree God can unveil what He has for us, if we prayerfully study His Word and allow the Holy Spirit to guide.

Hello Hobie;

Because of the forum rules I feel this thread cannot be discussed further. Let's move on to other discussions, brother.

bobinfaith

 

[Hobie]

Hello Hobie;

Because of the forum rules I feel this thread cannot be discussed further. Let's move on to other discussions, brother.

bobinfaith

That seems to be the best course.
God Bless my brother

 

[David]

I made my position very clear as best I can but feel we're discussing different things here (SDA?) and our points aren't aligning. This is where I'll respectfully bow out.

I understand, and I appreciate your tone. The reason this has become connected to SDA is because several of the points Hobie keeps raising match the core teachings of the Seventh Day Adventist teachings, ideas like a global “close of probation,” the “investigative judgment,” and an underlying mistrust of the reliability of Scripture as it stands.

When those same themes keep repeating, it’s not coincidence. It follows the same pattern Satan used from the beginning, planting subtle doubt in what God said. His first recorded words were, “Yea, hath God said…?” ~Genesis 3:1. He didn’t openly deny God; he questioned His Word. That same tactic shows up whenever people start suggesting that the Bible can’t be trusted unless it’s filtered through some manmade system or special interpretation.

Jesus faced the same kind of twisting in the wilderness when the devil quoted Scripture out of context ~Matthew 4:6, and Jesus answered with Scripture in full context ~Matthew 4:7. That’s the pattern we’re called to follow, test every teaching by the Word itself. “Test all things; hold fast what is good” ~1 Thessalonians 5:21.

So this isn’t about labeling anyone or creating division. It’s about guarding the truth. Once a discussion begins to question whether God’s Word can be trusted as written, it’s no longer a Bible study, it’s the same whisper the serpent used in Eden. Scripture tells us to “hold fast the form of sound words” ~2 Timothy 1:13 and “guard what has been entrusted” ~1 Timothy 6:20.

That’s why this forum stands on Scripture alone. I welcome open study of the text, but not teaching that erodes confidence in it. The line stays firm: if someone wants to study, great. If someone wants to plant mistrust in the Bible, that door stays closed.

 

[David]

Hello David;

I made my position very clear as best I can but feel we're discussing different things here (SDA?) and our points aren't aligning. This is where I'll respectfully bow out.

Last month I read the forum rules and have no issue at Biblical Truth Forum.

God bless everyone.

bobinfaith

For clarity, this discussion turned toward SDA teaching because several of Hobie’s statements match the core doctrines of Seventh-day Adventism rather than Scripture.

1. Close of Probation – Hobie has suggested that mercy for the world will end before Christ returns. The Bible never teaches a worldwide cutoff before His appearing. It says each person’s opportunity to repent ends at death (~Hebrews 9:27), and that the final separation happens when Christ returns in glory (~Matthew 25:31–46).
2. Investigative Judgment – Hobie has also spoken as if Christ is already reviewing lives to determine who will be saved before He returns. That mirrors SDA doctrine, not Scripture. The Bible teaches that judgment happens at Christ’s coming (~2 Corinthians 5:10, ~Acts 17:31), not in an ongoing heavenly investigation.
3. Undermining Scripture’s Clarity – His earlier posts about translations and “not being sure” what the text means follow a pattern often used to plant doubt in the Word. Scripture says, “All Scripture is God-breathed” and fully reliable (~2 Timothy 3:16).

This isn’t about attacking Hobie personally. It’s about guarding the foundation of truth. The SDA framework builds on ideas not found in the Word, and that’s why the discussion has to be corrected back to Scripture alone.

As always, compare everything said here with the Word of God itself (~Acts 17:11).

So, I would like to ask you if you are a Seventh-day Adventist?